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What do you guys think of Remmy?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by KoolGee, May 20, 2017.

  1. KoolGee

    KoolGee New Member

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    I'm liking how Remmy's storyline was kept more simple and made easier to finish than :amflirty:'s storyline and yet, Remmy still feels more fun to date overall and is WAY more believable as a character than what :amflirty: is right now.

    Say what you will about:amshy: but at least he's believably an asshole instead of just being a flat "I don't know/care what you do so leave" type of an asshole.

    Remmy feels believable and is fun to experience but her main drawback is that meeting her friend takes a bit TOO much trial and error for my liking. It took me 11 tries to figure out "don't say anything about the club amorous or anything remotely insulting"



    So now that I've talked a tad about my thoughts, I'd like to hear your guys' thoughts on Remmy.

    EDIT: Thanks to KakeiTheWolf for helping me to remember that the start of Remmy's date path is also problematic for some people.
    It goes in an interesting direction at first, being that it is one of the most varied starts to meeting any character, unfortunately the problem is that the direction it takes can either go off the rails in one way(like trying to date a random dude who Remmy initially has eyes for) or off the rails in another(like trying to FIGHT the random dude who Remmy is staring at).

    While those two problems do exist it's not hard to figure out how to date Remmy after 1-3 tries.
    Initially it took me 3 tries to get the right path due to curiosity of how far I could go with the guy Remmy has eyes for at the beginning.

    I will also admit that the staggering amount of branching pathways in the first time you see Remmy is impressive.
    EDIT OVER:
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2017
  2. Sir Wolf

    Sir Wolf Active Member

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    People said they had many troubles with Mercy's line but I made it through all in one go without having to retry anything, I have only scratched the surface of Remy's path, mostly due to her not being really my type to much, but she seems cute. I know I have heard tons of people had issues with her cooking minigame.

    But I overall loved Mercy, and hopefully Remy turns out just as good once I finish it.

    REALLY looking forward to Jacky ;)
     
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  3. Tussive

    Tussive New Member

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    The character isn't so very awful in either sense but a lot of the pieces surrounding her are distractingly bad, not the least of which is the writing for her dates. Like that whole heavily encouraged white knight act with the lifeguard. Not only was it -really- embarrassingly written, like some kind of bizarre revenge scenario (it actually reminded me of the really weird subplot from that 80s movie Revenge of the Nerds) full of lines that socially awkward goobers think would sound cool, lines that would make anyone else die from secondhand embarrassment, but it's written to be overtly fetishy to the point where the characters actually discuss draping some dom/sub mechanic over it instead of anything remotely naturalistic. And this is on top of MILF/chubby fetish vibes that the lifeguard points out (and a comment that the narrative voice really wants to condemn him for) despite that being the obvious bent of the character.

    Stuff like this sticks out so much and makes it such a terribly awkward read that the character herself just fades into the background and the impression I walked away with was almost entirely negative. But it wasn't aimed at the character in particular if only because she's bland without all the oddball window dressings of the awkward and often straight-out bad writing to the point where all the interest was in trying out the variations just to see how each separate train crashes and burns - and that high number of variations did contribute to the feeling that she was all gimmick.
     
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  4. KoolGee

    KoolGee New Member

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    Yeah, I can agree that Remmy seems like she was rushed out a bit. It seems that if her writing was changed so that the Dom/Sub stuff was more suttle that she'd appeal to more people
     
  5. Suddenly Tsumi

    Suddenly Tsumi Team Amorous Team Amorous

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    Some great comments here to bear in mind for tweaks! Glad there's some folks enjoying her and some excellent comments either way! ^^

    I had a few mission statements in mind for Remy in terms of critique from other date paths, including a little less serious than Mercy's path (the first I wrote on the project and a topic I know wasn't high on everyone's list, but I guess that's what the diversity of characters is for! Had some people who loved her too, so long as that happens I've done my job with such a diverse cast - trans positive reference was what we were going for there and getting a few notes from trans persons about loving the story made my day!)

    People also wanted a bit more straightforward than some of the other characters - Some people really struggled to get through the meeting with Mercy's friend or the opening conversations with Dustin or Zennith because the conversation types that seemed maybe natural or "in-character" to the player were the ones that NPC considered "hitting on him" or led to a bad end. With Remy's friend it's sort of the same as Mercy's where hitting on the friend or being a bit mean or inappropriate for the middle of the class is what they frown on - it's never one thing, as a tip, Wraak's dialogue has an "integer" system where bad responses add up towards the fail point and certain nice or modest responses earn you back points (if I remember, I think it's 3+ bad points with no redeeming ones that get you the failure, 2-ish gets you the okay end and there's a good end that goes with the cooking to determine the depth of a later phone conversation).

    We wanted to telegraph some of the responses in the branching options with, say "dominant response", "leave", "comfort" etc because it felt like the player's personality differences with some of the earlier dates didn't change the outcome much and some people also wanted a clearer difference between, say, dismissiveness or teasing flirting which some players struggled to define in the case of un-telegraphed dialogue options (in fact, if you check out Skye you can call her creepy to her face or insult her clothing and she still has sex with you, when I was playing it I could've sworn that was gonna get me a slap and i'd have to re-play it!).
    This time the personality choices actually determine her dialogue later where a submissive or dominant attitude changes the final date significantly as well as some details of the earlier scenes - some of them test the water to tell if she's receptive to, say, flattery etc - if you get the extended txt conversation there's another choice there that changes the final date too.

    I can see 'dominant' or 'submissive' seeming to be a fetish thing and yes, you can push for age difference or other fetish tags with the character, it's also just a term for attitude (like "alpha personality", "take charge" etc) on top of its use in talking about sexual compatibility and one that I felt was under-utilized with, say, Dustin and Zennith where you have to submit to them or stick up for yourself but also be sexually submissive or they lose interest or you're just forced to be "the bottom" or "the top" in the final scene without much say. Just like Dustin is sort of looking for a play thing, and Seth is looking for a friendly ear, Remy is looking for someone to take charge, that's her personality and why she likes Riptide, though she also sticks up for the player and takes charge if you pick the other options - The telegraphing is there to inform the player that choosing that particular option will change how the game will treat you in a way that was missing from some of the other dates where the player character has a bit of a personality shift between, say, dating Zennith and then dating Jax or Seth. If you don't seem super clear or play thing neutrally, Remy will even ask what you prefer, and, in the flirting options, being forward about your preferences with a partner is one of the ways to get her away from Riptide. Also, hey, a little fetish isn't too bad I hope :p It is a game based on sexuality and as much as going through all the dialogue options with Remy in the pool over and over takes about 2 hours, we can't draw things out too long before that 3 date limit comes up. We tried to have all our characters have hurdles, like a history to get over, their own confidence, trust, their own bodies etc - Remy's hurdle is that she's quite a sexual character and sort of used to getting swept along by people who want something quick - you can choose how quickly you sweep her along somewhat but we wanted to make it a bit clear what you were choosing (to the limits of a game where we only have 1,000 bits of dialogue before sex has to happen).

    As for Riptide? (our version at least, love the art of the OC and I think he's actually got a male preference!) Yep, he's an ass. He's supposed to be though. So many people got mixed messages from Rose and Zennith's interaction at the start of Zennith's date path and accidentally failed the date. We wanted to make it clear that this guy wasn't a date option - you can get a small intimate scene from him, but he also makes it clear he's not interested and, for story purposes - yeah, going with him makes Remy give up on him/you and leave. I know that standing up for Remy is a very "white knight" kind of thing that I hear tumblr has a really big problem with, maybe chivalry isn't a popular option these days? (is it still chivalry if you play a character who identifies as female?) But you also have the option to go up to riptide and just say she's not interested or never even bring up Remy and say his attitude stinks and walk off. Obviously, it's different if you hit on Remy whilst he's in eye-shot, since she was there to see him. It shortens his interaction significantly in the later scene if you don't provoke him - but some people might want to provoke him: I tried to have all the options there~ It would've been great to have him as a more 3D character and stretch out his involvement into a whole other date option, but we had to tread a line where people wouldn't be disappointed that this other male character is undate-able when trying to fill the female character roster and introduce another character as a hurdle outside of, say, Dustin's Ex. People want the bouncer or Coby's dad more involved as is ^_^; sadly it wasn't in our "node" limit to give him more of a gray area (Remy is already the longest date path). We wanted to make it clear that Riptide plays around and really isn't interested in the Player Character so he was a hurdle to Remy, not a charming distraction that ends in a frustrating end game for the player (like if he was more receptive he'd be kind of like Dustin, who you ARE supposed to go along with to get a satisfying date).

    A defense? A little. But, an explanation of why things are how they are also! I know we can't please everyone, but that's just what a community is, it's great to get feedback and see areas we can tweak and things people want to see more of for the tweaks to ALL the characters and the final new character path in the coming months!
     
  6. Sir Wolf

    Sir Wolf Active Member

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    This was a very great read! Awesome to hear your thought process for the dates and regards on what we thought of the dates! I thoroughly loved Mercy, and though Remy is not really my type so I have yet to finish her I have heard good things!

    Really looking forward to hearing more from you as the new dates come along, having a dialogue like this is really great. :)
     
  7. Tussive

    Tussive New Member

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    What makes all the lifeguard interactions fall on their face is the tone of the reaction to him vs. how he actually acts. There are a number of "enemy" characters in the game and some of them border on downright despicable behavior but the lifeguard is just...a typical college guy who's going overboard trying to act macho. Nothing he does is particularly grievous, honestly, but you have by far the most extreme options for "dealing with him" including just straight-out attacking him. That's what makes it feel like the player is being encouraged to participate in this badly conceived and written (and quite embarrassing) white knight scenario where he defends milady's honor and it's just -terribly- awkward. Especially considering you can easily just exchange two sentences with this person, talk to the lifeguard, and then start going on a tirade about how she deserves better. How would the player character even know?

    And then the guy shows up again and it feels like the scenario is insisting that you play Sir Rantsalot instead of trying to de-escalate the situation. The amount of offense that he's supposed to inspire just doesn't line up with what he actually does so most of the player's responses feel overblown and goofy - the fact that they're written p. goofy also contributes. Like that whole line in the one reasonable option about ~mutually assured destruction~ is so chuu2. And that attitude carrying over to overtly talking about phrasing the relationship as some dom/sub thing just makes the "offense" seem even more benign. If her main interest is in kinky sex then why was the lifeguard the bad guy for...also wanting mildly kinky sex?

    There's nothing inherently wrong with writing a character who's interested in phrasing the relationship around kinks but the way it's done sends oddly mixed messages and feels unrelateable if you're not into this very specific saving the chubby MILF from a beach bully and then discussing how you want to have an explicit (though mild) S&M relationship where you assign roles scenario.

    Also it's a weird response and does make her look bad that she asks the player character to hit on the guy for her if he turned out to be more interested in her than your character but then acts like she's been betrayed if you're successful. Wasn't the player character succeeding always a possibility and if that's how she acts about "losing" she was p. darn cheeky for expecting the PC to just shake it off and play wingman for her.
     
  8. KakeiTheWolf

    KakeiTheWolf Member

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    First off, the part I bolded? You've stated beautifully in a sentence what I tried to explain with a whole thread.

    Second, I personally haven't played Remmy's path, but from what I can tell, complexity is a massive issue in her path. On FA, the cooking segment near instantly became notorious for its large amounts of memorization, precise timing, and generally unforgiving setup. There is also the trial and error that is mentioned (Remmy is so far the only date path more difficult to start than Zenith's).

    I'll check the path out to see if there's any real character to counter this.
     
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  9. Lennian

    Lennian Dark Lord of Team Amorous Team Amorous

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    I find it funny how people have trouble with the mini-game, when...
    ...all the ingredients are actually already in the right order :p Initially we even thought it might too easy because there was no memorization involved anymore :p
    Guess furries are just bad readers ;)
     
  10. KakeiTheWolf

    KakeiTheWolf Member

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    As a furry, I take offense at this.

    And like I said, the issue was with people on FA. Problem is that naturally, people are extremely skeptical of answers blatantly spelled out in front of them. Why? Because the first thought is "Nah, that's way too easy and simple to REALLY be the answer".
     
  11. KoolGee

    KoolGee New Member

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    So far complexity is bottlenecked into two parts of Remmy's path:
    The beginning, with such a large amount of choices... it's ALMOST overwhelming while creating a lot of replayability to that first part of meeting Remmy.

    The second complex part(if you can call it that) would be the cooking section in which Remmy states how to put all the ingredients together.

    The second part requires a different thinking process than what is normally experienced from what we're used to in Amorous which is probably why there has been a high complaint count of how to make the cooking section easier while in reality it's only a minor amount of attention that's needed.

    Other than those two things, Remmy's path is generally enjoyable for a lot of people which makes it successful.

    When people don't enjoy a pathway is when that pathway has either failed, needs touch-ups, or needs entire rewrites.
     
  12. MirceaKitsune

    MirceaKitsune Active Member

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    She is awesome and adorable! This is the case for many characters, but she's around the top of that list by far.
     
  13. sonictron27

    sonictron27 New Member

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    Overall, Remy is a delight. In my opinion, she is the best girl in the entire game for a ton of reasons.

    First, her design is beautiful, cute, and alluring all packed into one package. For the longest time, though, I always thought that she was a kangaroo. It wasn't until the game itself told me that she was a bunny that I found out that she wasn't a kangaroo at all. Her ears and color scheme must have made me think something else. Besides that, though, she has a really nice design. In more ways than one...

    Second, her personality feels the most natural from the girls. She's cute, flirtatious, kind, and a bit motherly at times. However, when she wants to get kinky, oh boy... can she get kinky. That seductive look (you guys know the one) she gives always makes my blood warm up every time. At the same time, though, she can act like a genuinely nice person to hang with from time to time. If I ever met a person like Remy, I'd probably fall for them on sight.

    Third (and this is the most explicit of the reasons), her sex scene is one of the best in the game. The dialogue that follows it is just the icing on the cake. Plus, seeing Remy nude is simply amazing. Her lovely breasts, her gorgeous rump, her soft belly, her needy vagina--she is a grade A MILF, and I love it. Plus, the passion between the her and the player character was just adorable, and I felt my own heart beating while going through it. Overall, a very nice lewd scene.

    Despite all the nice things I've said about her, though, Remy does have problems. First, her third date where she becomes a cooking teacher felt like it dragged too long. I know the girl loves to cook, but I swear, that was the longest 5-10 minutes I think I've ever sat through. She does make up for it by having a simple but enjoyable minigame, not to mention one of the few minigames in the game.

    Another problem is not towards Remy herself, but to the lifeguard Riptide. This is more of a nitpick, but I didn't like when he was on screen, harassing Remy whenever he got the chance. It made me feel a bit uncomfortable. Granted, he's not as bad as some other assholes in the game (*cough* *cough* Vareoth *cough*), but he still comes off as off-putting.

    Overall, though, for having an amazing design, a nice storyline, an understandable and adorable personality, having one of the few minigames in the whole game, and having an incredible sex scene, Remy is simply a gem. A solid 8.5/10 in my eyes.
     

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