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The question of crowdfundind and patreon.

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Ganerumo, Jul 6, 2015.

  1. Ganerumo

    Ganerumo New Member

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    Hello there,

    I've been following Jason and Kabier's work for a really long time now (pretty much since Jason first started posting his animations on FA), and it's been fun to see their skills as animator and artist progress as time went on.

    However, with the recent development of the two games Amorous and Bare Backstreets, I've noticed something quite alarming, that maybe I and the rest of the community could help with - the funding of all these projects via Patreon is, to say the least, quite difficult to follow, and far from optimal.

    Let's round up all the existing patreon campaigns that Kabier and Jason run - there's Kabier's comic patreon, Jason's animation patreon, and then the Amorous and the Bare Backstreets patreons. That's a LOT of campaigns.

    Already, there's a problem here. Not a lot of people are able to chip in any significant amount of money into four patreons, and it's very discouraging to see all these projects run in so many different campaigns. Finding the BBS patreon was a bit of an effort since the page is not directly linked on Jason's main page (neither is Amorous, but that one is linked on the Amorous forums), it's difficult to keep track of all of them, and it feels very chaotic. I don't know who of Kabier or Jason runs these campaigns (other than Kabier's own patreon, which is pretty straight forward), but it's a whole lot of different links and budgets for a whole lot of projects.

    Patreon is designed around giving an artist a single blanket budget with which he may do however he please. Dividing these campaigns into so many different groups does not help at all, because it divides the budget in ways that aren't necessarily optimal and that may not even reflect how the money is really used. Moreover, the money in all of these patreons is far from equally distributed - while Jason and Kabier barely make 500 bucks per page/animation released, money that even when combined is far from enough to sustain a proper lifestyle when you release less than two pages/animations a month), the Amorous patreon is exploding with more than 3000 dollars poured into it every single month.

    I'm not a financial advisor, and I'm not a banker. What I am, is a concerned follower who's worried this fragmentation of all these projects may hurt the good development of Amorous, BBS, and the good production of the comics and animations Kabier and Jason are working on. If all of these projects were regrouped under a single, larger patreon with some of the stretch goals dedicated to some of the projects (Amorous' last stretch goal was at 1750, what of the remaining 1250 ? what are they used for ?), the ship would sail safer and steadier. Bare Backstreets is not exactly the kind of project that would require a brand new patreon, especially if it only gathers 30 bucks a month - it may as well be part of the Amorous patreon, and its development may as well be stretch goals to this project. People who pledge for the good development of Amorous will not protest against getting a second game as a bonus, especially if enough money's been gathered by now to guarantee Amorous' development for quite some time.
  2. Jasonafex

    Jasonafex Team Amorous Team Amorous

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    This would be a valid criticism should any of our campaigns are for pay-walled content. There is no requirement to support everything we work on. All our projects are free, meaning support is entirely optional and be optimised into any amount you are comfortable with.

    Bare Backstreets is a prime example of a game that fell into development due to how difficult things can be to have equal amounts of workloads and free time. Our BBS programmer was initially brought onto the team to help alleviate deadlock with Amorous, our seasoned programmers did not want an extra pair of hands and that teaching would take more time then doing things themselves, so to stay busy, we tasked him to taking the concepts and small handful of assets that had been laying around for BBS for many months and actually turning it into a functional game. This turned out to be a very productive decision.

    There was already internal debates as to cuts and how things were growing to be confusing now that we were working on two games, but it's only possible to make a clear set of goals and milestones for one. Giving BBS it's own Patreon ensures that if members of our staff are consistently producing content they can be compensated as such. Whichever game becomes more popular will garner priority, with the secondary being set to a per-update pledge system.

    My personal Patreon as well as Kabier's comic Patreon is already set to a per-upload system, meaning we don't receive any funding unless we produce content. The Amorous Patreon is already victim of extreme charge dodging. We receive far less then the displayed total. Combining these sources of income means we have to abandon the per-update method for 3/4 of our campaigns, lose all data as to what is popular and retain a 25% cut for particular staff members when the extra thousand is coming souly from our personal work that is unrelated to our games entirely. Knowing percentiles is a very important metric to discard simply for the sake of homogenisation.

    No-one is expected to fund all of our projects, much like how it isn't possible to fund multiple artists. If there is one (or two) projects you really like, that's entirely up to the user. The only issue I can honestly see here, is you don't like particular names being attached to more then one thing.
    Kiba Snowpaw likes this.
  3. locus

    locus New Member

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    So honorable. T-T
  4. Giul Xainx

    Giul Xainx New Member

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    I like the idea of BBS.

    Amorous I guess just isn't really for me. I played it with each new update and I just find myself clicking through everything without reading and just picking an answer that sounds like me. Which is odd because every single answer that I make seems to get me that awesome ending no matter what. I know everything is color coded so you can just say f u to one person and go quickly to the next. And I am glad the drama aspect is missing. But when i finally came back here to discover BBS? I had no idea of this project and now I fully support it.

    Yeah call me a whacko. It doesn't really phase me anymore. I am just glad that there is finally a place where A: the furry fandom doesn't have to push their ignorant views on us for posting such NSFW things. And B: Possibly having one hell of a video game that no one else has the balls to create. To me everything about BBS is like a double edged glass sword.

    We are not paying to play it. And we are not forced to support it. At the same time the team behind BBS isn't the Amorous team so you have two teams that are split up. So BBS is completely separate instead of putting the work load on one person. We can post up what we'd like to see, and they post up what they can handle. We continue to be able to say pervy shit, and the furry fandom see's that there is finally a DOOR. Yes a door that clearly states "Hey this is the area for those 'unwanted' fur fandom goers. Don't go in there."

    And, just to let you know ahead of time, if one of those furry fandom people come in here to try and start drama? I am going to treat them exactly how they treated me when I was trying to reach certain other furries. I will enforce conformity like they did me. Or they will forever be silenced. (Hey I am just giving a fair warning.)

    But still I wish I could give more support to BBS right now but as soon as I get some things in order? I might be able to up from 5 to at least 15. And possibly 25.
    Kiba Snowpaw likes this.

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